18 replies to this topic

[KingstonDon]

Space voyages shouldn't become politically incorrect

CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla. — It's the kind of question a presidential candidate might ask: "Why should we spend money on space programs and going to Mars, when we need dollars so desperately here on Earth?"
“For thousands of highly-skilled jobs, and the knowledge to survive,” says Princeton physicist Gene McCall, former chief scientist of the Air Force Space Command and a fellow at Los Alamos National Laboratory.

“If we spread the costs among an international consortium with many member nations," McCall told me, “we can afford a better, healthier life, protect our planet from incoming asteroids and space debris, and outsmart our destiny to become extinct.”

http://www.msnbc.msn...e/#.Tyz8pFwgPjs

This comes days after Newt Gingrich is quite frankly chastised for supporting another great human endeavour into space by putting a manned base on the moon. I was surprised to find so many people jumping on Gingrich's back for that comment.

Edited by KingstonDon, 04 February 2012 - 09:50 AM.

[shane_allen]

This comes days after Newt Gingrich is quite frankly chastised for supporting another great human endeavour into space by putting a manned base on the moon. I was surprised to find so many people jumping on Gingrich's back for that comment.

The point of a moon base would be? Right now, I see that it would be a much bigger challenge and cost then it would pay off. Instead of trying to make a habitat were the solar system clearly doesn't want us to be, we could use the time and energy toward other research that will later make the moon base easier but that have immediate applications here on earth, like solar technologies.

I'm not saying that it wouldn't be cool, or that it wouldn't be better compared to all the other stupid shit we humans spend our time on. My argument is only that it's too soon to start promising a permanent moon base within 8 years.

[Craven]

Now it's not very important now, but we gotta start exploring space, before this planet becomes our grave. In future moon base would serve as port, last stop before leaving for outer space. I'm not going to go into theme of mining moon, because there are still many variables and unknowns.

[jjf3]

Newt Gingrich has been attacked for his grandiose ideas about creating a lunar colony. Today, Kennedy is considered one of the best Presidents in history. Can America be great again and go back into space? I am shocked that the media is giving Newt a hard time and not even considering his ideas. They are the ones that are tired of all the oil wars. Do you know what will stop this? Mining the Moon!!!! Kennedy did the same thing and is seen as one of the best Presidents in history even though he had a questionable past with the bootleggers. I copied this from one of the comments from the article because it illustrates my point clearly:

What a lot of the anti-space crowd doesn't understand is that we shipped out / sold out the technology and tooling that we had developed in the USA that supported middle class jobs. Television, microchips, computers, calculators, wireless phones, DVD players, IPODS. That technology is gone for good now, in China, Vietnam, Korea, etc. We either all flip hamburgers for each other OR we develop NEW technology. The world's leading expert on Solar Power technology? NASA! World's leading experts on compact nuclear power? US Navy and NASA! Water purification and recycling in compact units? NASA! Who besides NASA and the military does advanced research these days in the USA? Not corporations! Spending money on space produces jobs, both directly and indirectly. It gives us something to build a new economy upon. Bank bailouts and welfare give us nothing but more future bills!

I'm no fan of big government but when Obama cuts NASA the ONLY government program that can actually do the things he wants and when three of the four candidates for President do not support space travel at all. It really makes me upset. You want a bold plan to fix the economy? Well folks mining the moon is just as plausible as anything else we've got!

A world tax will fix the economy? Give me a break! Eventually they will run out of other people's money!!!!!!!!

http://www.foxnews.c...intcmp=features

[Craven]

Newt Gingrich has been attacked for his grandiose ideas about creating a lunar colony. Today, Kennedy is considered one of the best Presidents in history. Can America be great again and go back into space? I am shocked that the media is giving Newt a hard time and not even considering his ideas.

Maybe because it's unrealistic campagin bullshit? I'm guessing almost everyone on this forum would love to see moon base, and I'm sure almost as much users here are certain he wouldn't/won't fulfill this promise.

Calling people who call bullshit on this idea "anti space crowd" is pure idiocy.

Oh and for the record it's too early to mine moon. I think some people don't have a clue about difficulty scale of such thing.

[jjf3]

They said the same thing to Kennedy and we did that with 1960s technology!

[Craven]

Did what? Land on Moon at lurdiculous cost? Yeah.

[jjf3]

Did what? Land on Moon at lurdiculous cost? Yeah.

Yeah so that's a bad thing because??? You guys always want to spend money on pointless stuff, why not spend money on something USEFUL!

[Craven]

I didn't say it was bad thing (buy yes it wasn't best, if things were done differently we'd have moon base around 90's). I just pointed out that you're derailing topic.

So once again, this time I'll try to keep it simple and arranged in list:

- Gingrich is ridiculed, because it's campagin unrealistic talk and noone believes that.
- Term "anti-space crowd" is idiotic attempt to manipulate discussion.
- Mining moon right now wouldn't be profitable.

[jjf3]

unrealistic just like Kennedy. I didn't call you anti-space, that's the commenter on the fox news article.

Mining the moon wouldn't be profitable? Says... You?

[Craven]

- No, not like Kennedy. Like Gingrich.
- I know you didn't, that idiot commenter did.
- Says cost of such project. We're years from that. Right now we still have rare metals here, heavy water for fusion power plants that have not yet been designed. Do you have slightest idea about problems with mining moon? Do you know what it would take to ship tons of equipement, half million kilometers from Earth, and then ship mined materials back? Do you realise that most of our technologies are accustomed to atmospheric conditions, and that equipement breaks on daily basis and is constantly repaired or replaced?
Yes, one day maybe we'll mine the moon. But not anytime soon.

[shane_allen]

They are the ones that are tired of all the oil wars. Do you know what will stop this? Mining the Moon!!!!

There isn't oil on the moon. If you are referring to the push to get there causing a massive research effort on alternative fuel sources that end oil wars: We can do that without putting a base on the moon where people would mine... uh, water? Wait, what are we going there to mine? Does the moon have anything?

Again, to push a ludicrous goal for the sake of researching useful technologies is okay, but clearly the better option is to just research those technologies in earnest.

[Roh234]

They are the ones that are tired of all the oil wars. Do you know what will stop this? Mining the Moon!!!!

There isn't oil on the moon. If you are referring to the push to get there causing a massive research effort on alternative fuel sources that end oil wars: We can do that without putting a base on the moon where people would mine... uh, water? Wait, what are we going there to mine? Does the moon have anything?

Again, to push a ludicrous goal for the sake of researching useful technologies is okay, but clearly the better option is to just research those technologies in earnest.

He3

ButI do agree that moon mining and a lunar base should be a priority once the deficit is 0 and debt is at manageble levels and we have the technology to process He3.

[shane_allen]

Oooh, "He₃"; Helium-3! I thought you meant he-three or Heath or something. Yeah, sure that's a fine reason. I'm glad you said that we should wait till we need it though.

[jjf3]

So we should wait til we need THIS, but we should get off oil right NOW so we can convert into alternative energies right away??!!

See what I mean about the flip flopping? Right now, we have NO plans for a Moon Base or a Mission to Mars, Obama scraped those. We should continue to work on that.

[Deadbolt]

If and when going to the moon is economical, then we will go. People would laugh at Gingrich if he said the sky was blue though.

Edited by Deadbolt, 05 February 2012 - 06:03 AM.

[shane_allen]

So we should wait til we need THIS, but we should get off oil right NOW so we can convert into alternative energies right away??!!

Pretty much.

See, we don't need anything the moon has right now. At least not bad enough to mine there at incredible costs.
We do need alternative energies though. At least bad enough to develop them at relatively low costs.

What is it that you think would come out of the moon base? I'm asking for concrete answers, like "water" or "oil" or "He₃."

[truthiness]

Not sure how long this'll last on YouTube, but I thought you'd all enjoy this, if you haven't already seen it...

[Logically Irrational]

^^ Wow, I'm glad I got to see that.