50 replies to this topic

[Craven]

You can treat it as experiment, or as a riddle. Or you can just ignore it.

Imagine it's a signal from extraterrestial civilisation. Signal has number of amplitudes, below is it's alphabetical representation. That means that instead of ABC there could be 123 or Red-Orange-Yellow. So don't get attached to letters. You can also assume that this message is meant to be undestood.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXBACADAEAFAGAHABCACCADCXAECAFCAGCAHCABDACDADDAXAEDAFDAGDAHDABEACEADEAXAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAXAAIAAJAAKAALAAAAAAAMAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAIAAAAAAAAAAXACICMDAADIEMGAAFIHME
CAXBIEMEAGDIDFMBBCAGIFMDCXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAJAAAAAAAAAAXBCJCMHAEGJBMEGADFJCMCFXEJEMBAB
BCJBCMBHAGJEMDAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAKAAAAAAAAAAXDKEMHAAFCKBMBAAGKCMGAAXEKBCMBEAGKGMFEADK
HMGCAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAALAAAAAAAAAAXHLDMEAADGLCMDGABLFMBAAXBDLDMBCAGLGMCAGFLFCMEAXAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAANAAAAAOAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAACICMDAANAAACICMGAAOAXACCJEMEAAOAAAD
CLEMEANAXABCKFMBFANAAAGCJGMHAOAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAPPAAAQQAAAPPAAAQQAAXQ
APAAPAQAAQAPAAPAQAAQAXAQAAAAPAAAAQAAAAPAAAAQXPAQAAQAPAAPAQAAQAPAAPAXAAAQQAAAPPAAAQQAAAPPAAXAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAASAAAUAAAVAAAWAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAASAAAAAAAAA
AXARCKGARHKGARBCKGARCCKBXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAUAAAAAAAAAAXARCKHARHKGARBCKDARCCKDXAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAVAAAAAAAAAAXARCKGARHKGARBCKGARCCKCXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAWAAAAAA
AAAAXARCKGARHKFARBCKEARCCKCXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXASUANAAAASVAOAAAASWAOAXAUSAN
AAAAUVAOAAAAUWAOAXAVSAOAAAAVUAOAAAAVWANAXAWSAOAAAAWUAOAAAAWVANAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAXVVWSVSWVUVVWSVSWVUVVWSXWWVUWUVWSWWVUWUVWSWWVUXAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAX

Have fun. Share your thoughts. Cooperate, or try to make sense of it on your own.

PS. Oh - and it's meant o be a single line, i placed new lines just because forum has no automatic line break. So it should be like that:

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

EDIT: One last thing - it may be helpful to know that message has 1403 symbols.

Edited by Craven, 03 July 2012 - 01:08 PM.

[shane_allen]

Straight conversion to numbers where a=1,b=2....j=(10),k=(11)... etc.
Random line breaks were added to fit the screen.
There are no T, Y or Z's.

I break it up into chunks beginning with 22 A's in a row, followed by an X. I notice that these chunks always end with another X.


1111111111111111111111(24)2131415161718123133143(24)
1531631731831241341441(24)1541641741841251351451(24)
1111111111111111111111(24)11911(10)11(11)11(12)11111
11(13)11(24)1111111111111111111111(24)11111111111911
11111111(24)1393(13)411495(13)711698(13)531(24)295
(13)5174946(13)2231796(13)43(24)11111111111111111111
11(24)11111111111(10)1111111111(24)23(10)3(13)8157
(10)2(13)57146(10)3(13)36(24)5(10)5(13)21223(10)23
(13)2817(10)5(13)41(24)1111111111111111111111(24)111
11111111(11)1111111111(24)4(11)5(13)81163(11)2(13)21
17(11)3(13)711(24)5(11)23(13)2517(11)7(13)6514(11)8
(13)731(24)1111111111111111111111(24)11111111111(12)
1111111111(24)8(12)4(13)51147(12)3(13)4712(12)6(13)2
11(24)24(12)4(13)2317(12)7(13)3176(12)63(13)51(24)11
11111111111111111111(24)11111111(14)11111(15)1111111
(24)1111111111111111111111(24)11393(13)411(14)111393
(13)711(15)1(24)133(10)5(13)511(15)11143(12)5(13)51
(14)1(24)123(11)6(13)261(14)11173(10)7(13)81(15)1(24)
1111111111111111111111(24)1111111111111111111111(24)
111(16)(16)111(17)(17)111(16)(16)111(17)(17)11(24)
(17)1(16)11(16)1(17)11(17)1(16)11(16)1(17)11(17)1(24)
1(17)1111(16)1111(17)1111(16)1111(17)(24)(16)1(17)11
(17)1(16)11(16)1(17)11(17)1(16)11(16)1(24)111(17)
(17)111(16)(16)111(17)(17)111(16)(16)11(24)111111
1111111111111111(24)1111111111111111111111(24)111
1(19)111(21)111(22)111(23)11111(24)11111111111111
11111111(24)11111111111(19)1111111111(24)1(18)3
(11)71(18)8(11)71(18)23(11)71(18)33(11)2(24)11111
11111111111111111(24)11111111111(21)1111111111(24)
1(18)3(11)81(18)8(11)71(18)23(11)41(18)33(11)4(24)
1111111111111111111111(24)11111111111(22)111111111
1(24)1(18)3(11)71(18)8(11)71(18)23(11)71(18)33(11)
3(24)1111111111111111111111(24)11111111111(23)1111
111111(24)1(18)3(11)71(18)8(11)61(18)23(11)51(18)3
3(11)3(24)1111111111111111111111(24)11111111111111
11111111(24)1(19)(21)1(14)1111(19)(22)1(15)1111(19)
(23)1(15)1(24)1(21)(19)1(14)1111(21)(22)1(15)1111
(21)(23)1(15)1(24)1(22)(19)1(15)1111(22)(21)1(15)11
11(22)(23)1(14)1(24)1(23)(19)1(15)1111(23)(21)1(15)
1111(23)(22)1(14)1(24)1111111111111111111111(24)111
1111111111111111111(24)(22)(22)(23)(19)(22)(19)(23)
(22)(21)(22)(22)(23)(19)(22)(19)(23)(22)(21)(22)
(22)(23)(19)(24)(23)(23)(22)(21)(23)(21)(22)(23)
(19)(23)(23)(22)(21)(23)(21)(22)(23)(19)(23)(23)
(22)(21)(24)1111111111111111111111(24)

Edited by shane_allen, 04 July 2012 - 12:36 AM.

[Craven]

Yay That's the first step - 1403 = 23 * 61, X marks new line.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
BACADAEAFAGAHABCACCADC
AECAFCAGCAHCABDACDADDA
AEDAFDAGDAHDABEACEADEA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAIAAJAAKAALAAAAAAAMAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAIAAAAAAAAAA
ACICMDAADIEMGAAFIHMECA
BIEMEAGDIDFMBBCAGIFMDC
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAJAAAAAAAAAA
BCJCMHAEGJBMEGADFJCMCF
EJEMBABBCJBCMBHAGJEMDA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAKAAAAAAAAAA
DKEMHAAFCKBMBAAGKCMGAA
EKBCMBEAGKGMFEADKHMGCA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAALAAAAAAAAAA
HLDMEAADGLCMDGABLFMBAA
BDLDMBCAGLGMCAGFLFCMEA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAANAAAAAOAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AACICMDAANAAACICMGAAOA
ACCJEMEAAOAAADCLEMEANA
ABCKFMBFANAAAGCJGMHAOA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAPPAAAQQAAAPPAAAQQAA
QAPAAPAQAAQAPAAPAQAAQA
AQAAAAPAAAAQAAAAPAAAAQ
PAQAAQAPAAPAQAAQAPAAPA
AAAQQAAAPPAAAQQAAAPPAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAASAAAUAAAVAAAWAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAASAAAAAAAAAA
ARCKGARHKGARBCKGARCCKB
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAUAAAAAAAAAA
ARCKHARHKGARBCKDARCCKD
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAVAAAAAAAAAA
ARCKGARHKGARBCKGARCCKC
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAWAAAAAAAAAA
ARCKGARHKFARBCKEARCCKC
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
ASUANAAAASVAOAAAASWAOA
AUSANAAAAUVAOAAAAUWAOA
AVSAOAAAAVUAOAAAAVWANA
AWSAOAAAAWUAOAAAAWVANA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
VVWSVSWVUVVWSVSWVUVVWS
WWVUWUVWSWWVUWUVWSWWVU
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Edited by Craven, 04 July 2012 - 06:54 AM.

[Saradus]

I dunno whether I'm actually onto something here or whether I'm way off track, but here's what I've got so far:



The talk about signals, extraterrestrials and particularly when you displayed it as a 23-width column reminded me of SETI's Arecibo message, so I assumed A to be 0 and everything else to be 1 and threw the string into a game of life simulator to get a nice graphical block display rather than text.

While the image clearly has a pattern to it (do I spy a double helix there?), it isn't a coherent message yet, so no doubt I'm missing some kind of importance to the difference in letters (other than A) and can't just take them all to be 1.

[Craven]

I'm doing my best not to spoil too much fun. So I'll just remain silent. I believe you guys can do it on your own.

[shane_allen]

There's too much apparent pattern in the things that are not A's to just throw them all out. They could represent different shades of color...

6. AAIAAJAAKAALAAAAAAAMAA
12. AAAAAAAAAAAJAAAAAAAAAA
16. AAAAAAAAAAAKAAAAAAAAAA
20. AAAAAAAAAAALAAAAAAAAAA
24. AAAAAAAANAAAAAOAAAAAAA
 

AAAPPAAAQQAAAPPAAAQQAA
QAPAAPAQAAQAPAAPAQAAQA
AQAAAAPAAAAQAAAAPAAAAQ
PAQAAQAPAAPAQAAQAPAAPA
AAAQQAAAPPAAAQQAAAPPAA

The first part is an order of letters. The secound block is your double helix in Ps and Qs!

[Craven]

There's too much apparent pattern in the things that are not A's to just throw them all out. They could represent different shades of color...

But then again, would colors have any meaning?

...PP...QQ...PP...QQ..
Q.P..P.Q..Q.P..P.Q..Q.
.Q....P....Q....P....Q
P.Q..Q.P..P.Q..Q.P..P.
...QQ...PP...QQ...PP..

It does look like a double helix...

[Saradus]

Ah, now looking at the pattern of the non-A letters for the double helix it looks as if the higher the letter, the higher it's z-axis elevation (coming out of the screen).

So the alphabet is being used to represent the 3rd dimension of this "signal". At least that's my guess. I have no quick way of simulating a 3 dimensional graphic so I won't draw this out to test my theory, I'll leave that to somebody else (unless I can find a way of doing it quickly)

[shane_allen]

Ah, now looking at the pattern of the non-A letters for the double helix it looks as if the higher the letter, the higher it's z-axis elevation

Aahh, but then it'd really just have two values, say 16 and 17. Not much of a helix, just two wiggly lines on different planes.

what your thinking of is:

caaaaaa
adaaaaa
aaeaaaa
aaafaaa
aaaaeaa
aaaaada
aaaaaac

Right?

Edited by shane_allen, 06 July 2012 - 01:35 AM.

[Craven]

I may be wrong, but it seems to me like you guys want/hope to solve whole thing in single step/sweep.
Maybe try to focus on first few lines and figure them out.

[shane_allen]

I put it into excel and gave each symbol it's own cell to make a grid. I'm messing around with coloring and whatnot and haven't gotten much yet.

When you delete all the A's, it certainly cleans it up and you see a lot of order in it.


Line 6 reads: I J K L M

Then chunks of the next sections are given what looks like headers in those letters, except for M, so I think that's important.

Edited by shane_allen, 06 July 2012 - 01:10 PM.

[Craven]

Actually even plain txt file editor is ok - maintains arrangement and has option to change (for example to swap all A's for " " space).
My students cracked it like that. But they had little pushes form me - we only had 90 minutes.
Keep at it guys, I want to see that it can be done without any hints.

[Craven]

I was thinking about those colors and maybe it may be helpful to use them...


I J K L M

I
CICMD DIEMG FIHMEC
BIEME GDIDFMBBC GIFMDC

J
BCJCMH EGJBMEG DFJCMCF
EJEMB BBCJBCMBH GJEMD

K
DKEMH FCKBMB GKCMG
EKBCMBE GKGMFE DKHMGC

L
HLDME DGLCMDG BLFMB
BDLDMBC GLGMC GFLFCME



edit: heh it's either [ code ] that keeps spaces, or coloring. Anyway I'll just live it here.

Edited by Craven, 06 July 2012 - 10:35 PM.

[Craven]

Arghhh can't stop myself, made little from editor and previos post by Saradus:

[shane_allen]

Gah. I'm working on it a few minutes here and there. So, just be patient.

I'm trying to see if I should rotate the text to align certain letters but I didn't get much.
Also tried deleting in sequences, so for SUVW:

SITUIPWVVWS becomes
S__U___V_W

Still nothing

Edited by shane_allen, 07 July 2012 - 12:35 AM.

[Craven]

Sure thing I'm just bit excited about this Again - i jumped to lines 6 and latter, but lines 2,3,4 are still there
Got lotsa shit to do - will be patient.

[Craven]

Hmm maybe I overshot it a bit. I'll try to prepare slightly diffrent version of message tomorrow or in coming days.

[shane_allen]

Yeah, I'm into soduko and whatnot but beyond what I got, I'm stuck. I was thinking someone else would get the answer. Guess not.

[Saradus]

Sorry, I did try using what we've got so far for a good half hour or so and just couldn't get anywhere no matter what I tried! It might be that a little hint will suddenly cause everything to click and the gears to start moving but we'll have to wait and see

[Craven]

OK, here's a new version. Remember that it's meant to be uncoded. Try not to jump into middle, but go from start, that should make things easier later

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ		
BACADAEAFAGAHAIACBACCAZ		
ACDACEACFACGACHACIADBAZ
ADCADDADEADFADGADHADIAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAJAAKAALAAMAAAAAAANAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAJAAAAAAAAAAZ
ACJCNDAADJENGAAFJHNCDAZ
BJENEACDJHHNCBBAGJFNCDZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAKAAAAAAAAAAZ
CBKCNIAEGKBNEGAFDKCNFCZ
EKENBACBBKCBNIBAGKENDAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAALAAAAAAAAAAZ
DLENHAAFCLBNBAAGLCNGAAZ
ELCBNEBAGLGNECADLHNCFAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAMAAAAAAAAAAZ
HMDNEAADGMCNDGABMFNBAAZ
DBMDNCBAGMGNCAFGMCFNEAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAOAAAAAPAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AACJCNDAAOAAACJCNGAAPAZ
ACCKENEAAPAAADCMENGAOAZ
ACBLFNFBAOAAACEKGN8APAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAQQAAARRAAAQQAAARRAAZ
RAQAAQARAARAQAAQARAARAZ
ARAAAAQAAAARAAAAQAAAARZ
QARAARAQAAQARAARAQAAQAZ
AAARRAAAQQAAARRAAAQQAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAUAAAVAAAWAAAXAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAUAAAAAAAAAAZ
ASCLGASHLGASILGASCBLBAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAVAAAAAAAAAAZ
ASCLHASHLGASILDASCBLDAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAWAAAAAAAAAAZ
ASCLGASHLGASILGASCBLCAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAXAAAAAAAAAAZ
ASCLGASHLFASILEASCBLCAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AUVAOAAAAUWAPAAAAUXAPAZ
AVUAOAAAAVWAPAAAAVXAPAZ
AWUAPAAAAWVAPAAAAWXAOAZ
AXUAPAAAAXVAPAAAAXWAOAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ
WWXUWUXWVWWXUWUXWVWWXUZ
XXWVXVWXUXXWVXVWXUXXWVZ
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZ

I'll try not to say anything from now on especially since from friday my access to net will be limited.

Edited by Craven, 11 July 2012 - 07:49 AM.