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gay marriage homosexuality LGBT+ transgender gay marriage bisexuality

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#61
SG-1

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No, but not everyone is parent material.  If they really wanted to help a kid, but were gay they could help run the orphanage. 

 

I mean, then they aren't personal with the kids.  They don't really have the same connection as parent when they are working at an orphanage.  They could donate, spread awareness of child abuse or anything.

 

It is a sensitive subject, but I just hope people put the kid's interests above the parents.  Why don't straight people adopt more?  That's the easiest solution.. or have stricter regulations on  orphanages.


Hey.  Stop reading.  The post is over.


#62
StanleyAlexander

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Bullying is an evil thing no matter what the reason... but at the same time, inequalities and the grade school survival struggle are part of growing up in the world we live in.  That's not a reason to ban gay adoption.

 

If more kids had gay parents, less people would be uncomfortable with homosexuality and the world would be a more open-minded place.  We would be doing humanity a favor by letting gay people adopt children.


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#63
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I don't think that is necessarily true.

 

Even if every adopted kid had gay parents.  It wouldn't solve anything.  (Well, if EVERY orphan kid had gay parent's it may make things worse by associating orphan kids with gay parents).

 

It isn't just about bullying at school, its about keeping kids emotionally stable.  If a kid is uncomfortable with his or her gay parents, do you think the kid would see them as a role model? No.  Would the kid want to talk about his problems?  Not as much, what about problems with relationships, well obviously no, unless the kid was gay too.  Those kids wouldn't see them as a family, there would only be one gender.  Isn't it important to have role models for each gender?  Even a male needs a mom.  It's important, each gender provides a specific part of being a parent.  One without the other is not healthy I think.  Now, my parents are divorced, my dad was emotionally abusive, and I guess I don't have a good role model for a male, but I know what not to do.  I have uncles, I see my dad every once and a while.  If you argue, well what about if one parent died?  Well, then they would have a legacy or maybe that kid's mom got remarried.

 

Kids need a healthy environment to grow up, all I am saying is (unless there is an extreme case of abuse in an orphanage) gay parents are worse than an orphanage.  I don't like either one, but because we live in reality - nothing is perfect and kids grow up in bad environments.


Hey.  Stop reading.  The post is over.


#64
StanleyAlexander

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The only reason to think that a kid would be uncomfortable with his gay parents is because we (you and I) have grown up in a society where being gay is weird.


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#65
Logically Irrational

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This has always been a subject that hits pretty close to home for me, since I know two people who are the adopted children of gay parents. Now, I'm fully aware of the fallacy that goes along with this (personal experience, individual examples, etc.), but I've never seen any evidence for psychological damage instilled by having two dads. In fact, quite the opposite. They're really some of the most tolerant and friendly people that I know. I could go on about them, but you get the idea.

 

I guess I'll address this at SG-1 mostly, just since he's had the most to say. No worries though, it's all on friendly terms.  :)

 

I never really bought the whole issue of needing a male and female parent as a role model. It certainly doesn't jive with my own experience at least. Now, I don't doubt that a child needs exposure to the different aspects of different genders, probably from a young age. But does that need to be offered by the parents alone? Humanity has been an incredibly social species throughout it's history, and the "normal" family structure of children being raised by two parents has more often than not been abnormal. Today, unless the family is completely isolated for some reason, parents aren't the only one's raising the kid. From the very beginning, a person is shaped by their mother, father, close friends, aunts, uncles, media, and surrounding community. I don't think a person needs a female presence in the form of a mother for example when their lives are inevitably filled with females playing role model in everyday settings. Certainly not for psychological development anyway.

http://www.cpa.ca/cp...er 2006 (1).pdf

http://newsroom.ucla...gay-239748.aspx

http://cdn.ca9.uscou...27/amicus29.pdf

http://www.psycholog...-Lit-Review.pdf

http://cms.bsu.edu/-...nd Lesbians.pdf

 

I think the idea that a child's psychological development could be damaged due to their "discomfort with having gay parents" is based on the fact that society in general is currently uncomfortable. If someone is raised by gay parents, would they have any reason to feel uncomfortable? Probably not, at least not through any natural disposition. There are certainly statistics out there that show people raised by same-sex couples are more prone to mental problems, but this is almost always attributed to the reaction of society, not to the home environment itself. Using relationship advice as an example, I'm not sure why having two dads would discourage someone from seeking it. If they really do love each other, a gay couple should have no trouble talking about the more general points of a relationship with their kid. I know there are differences between homosexual and heterosexual relationships, but if they're good parents, you would think that they would come to the conversation prepared for this.

 

And really, the fact that kids with gay parents are more frequently bullied isn't an argument against gay adoption. It's an argument against bullying and the toxic attitude our culture has towards gays. In any case, arguing that gay adoption should be discourage because the result is a less well-rounded individual seems like a slippery thing to say, since it brings up the tendencies of children in every minority and demographic. What can be said about the differences between children from white families and black families?

 

In relation to children living in orphanages, I would say living with gay adoptive parents would be quite preferable. From what I've read of child psychology, one of the most important aspects of early development is the presence of an emotionally attached, caring parent figure. In a group environment, particularly with orphanages, that aspect of childhood is often missed. Not as a result of direct abuse, but as a result of care-givers being too busy to create that emotional connection. In most research, the focus is almost never on the gender roles that parents can have. The focus is on the emotional relationship they have with their children. Put simply, it's not the gender of the parent that matters, it's the quality of the parenting. I know it's cliche, but love really is the most important thing.

 

All in all, I don't see any reason (psychological, societal, religious, etc.) why same-sex adoption, let along marriage, should be discouraged.


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#66
Italian Ufo

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Maybe you guys are right.

 

All I know is, I don't like being around gay people.  I haven't. Ever. Not even when I was little.  So if I had gay parents, I would do everything in my power to get away from them. 

 

I don't make friends with someone I know is gay, if I am friends with someone and it turns out they are gay, then nothing changes and we are still friends (has happened before, I consider anyone on this website a friend).  I just think it looks bad and is awkward making friends with someone who is gay.

 

Having my parents be gay would really be awkward.  I'd hate it.  I wouldn't be able to stand the thought of them sharing a bed together in the house that I lived in

 

That is just my opinion, it may sound cruel but sorry, I don't mean it to be.  I can respect someone's life choices, but I don't want them imposed on me.  The reason I am ok with it, is because I think being gay has more to do with genetics or some other biological factor rather than personal choice.

 

I worked at mcdonald when I was 23 and 90% of them were gay.. They were mostly awesome...they made me laugh, they were very understanding and even kind to explain you how to work..the best part is that gay people have lots of beautiful girlfriends so they could introduse to me..to be honest I really enjoyed working with them...I respected them and they respected me...nothing akward ever happen..however few irritated me..you know when they claimed how better it is to be gay..others were too direct when commentin on people's body..even when they wanted to offend you..not just complimented..but nasty people are everywhere even among straight...anyway...You should try to hang out with them...i am sure you will find lots of good gay people



#67
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This has always been a subject that hits pretty close to home for me, since I know two people who are the adopted children of gay parents. Now, I'm fully aware of the fallacy that goes along with this (personal experience, individual examples, etc.), but I've never seen any evidence for psychological damage instilled by having two dads. In fact, quite the opposite. They're really some of the most tolerant and friendly people that I know. I could go on about them, but you get the idea.

 

I guess I'll address this at SG-1 mostly, just since he's had the most to say. No worries though, it's all on friendly terms.  :)

 

I never really bought the whole issue of needing a male and female parent as a role model. It certainly doesn't jive with my own experience at least. Now, I don't doubt that a child needs exposure to the different aspects of different genders, probably from a young age. But does that need to be offered by the parents alone? Humanity has been an incredibly social species throughout it's history, and the "normal" family structure of children being raised by two parents has more often than not been abnormal. Today, unless the family is completely isolated for some reason, parents aren't the only one's raising the kid. From the very beginning, a person is shaped by their mother, father, close friends, aunts, uncles, media, and surrounding community. I don't think a person needs a female presence in the form of a mother for example when their lives are inevitably filled with females playing role model in everyday settings. Certainly not for psychological development anyway.

http://www.cpa.ca/cp...er 2006 (1).pdf

http://newsroom.ucla...gay-239748.aspx

http://cdn.ca9.uscou...27/amicus29.pdf

http://www.psycholog...-Lit-Review.pdf

http://cms.bsu.edu/-...nd Lesbians.pdf

 

I think the idea that a child's psychological development could be damaged due to their "discomfort with having gay parents" is based on the fact that society in general is currently uncomfortable. If someone is raised by gay parents, would they have any reason to feel uncomfortable? Probably not, at least not through any natural disposition. There are certainly statistics out there that show people raised by same-sex couples are more prone to mental problems, but this is almost always attributed to the reaction of society, not to the home environment itself. Using relationship advice as an example, I'm not sure why having two dads would discourage someone from seeking it. If they really do love each other, a gay couple should have no trouble talking about the more general points of a relationship with their kid. I know there are differences between homosexual and heterosexual relationships, but if they're good parents, you would think that they would come to the conversation prepared for this.

 

And really, the fact that kids with gay parents are more frequently bullied isn't an argument against gay adoption. It's an argument against bullying and the toxic attitude our culture has towards gays. In any case, arguing that gay adoption should be discourage because the result is a less well-rounded individual seems like a slippery thing to say, since it brings up the tendencies of children in every minority and demographic. What can be said about the differences between children from white families and black families?

 

In relation to children living in orphanages, I would say living with gay adoptive parents would be quite preferable. From what I've read of child psychology, one of the most important aspects of early development is the presence of an emotionally attached, caring parent figure. In a group environment, particularly with orphanages, that aspect of childhood is often missed. Not as a result of direct abuse, but as a result of care-givers being too busy to create that emotional connection. In most research, the focus is almost never on the gender roles that parents can have. The focus is on the emotional relationship they have with their children. Put simply, it's not the gender of the parent that matters, it's the quality of the parenting. I know it's cliche, but love really is the most important thing.

 

All in all, I don't see any reason (psychological, societal, religious, etc.) why same-sex adoption, let along marriage, should be discouraged.

 

/thread


"Let teachers and priests and philosophers brood over questions of reality and illusion. I know this: if life is an illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and I am content." -Conan the Cimmerian


#68
Alric

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Replace every instance of gay with black and see if it makes any difference to you. Then try it again and replace every instance of gay with christian and see if that changes it. It shouldn't and if it does then I think you should really reconsider why you are judging others, because they are not really any different than you are.


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#69
ADAM LESTER ELLIOTT

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State legislature to consider also LGBT-inclusive anti- discrimination bill. Here is the link to get there:http://www.lgbtqnati...rtisan-support/



#70
SG-1

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Well we all know eventually same sex marriage will be legal in every developed country.  We will see how far this one goes.


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Hey.  Stop reading.  The post is over.


#71
ADAM LESTER ELLIOTT

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SG-1 and this is a republican "red conservative" state!



#72
Cody930

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Being the last New England state to not have it passed, after a 51-19 vote the bill moves to the state senate. However, its fate is still uncertain there. 

 

RHODE ISLAND HOUSE PASSES GAY MARRIAGE BILL

 

http://bigstory.ap.o...te-gay-marriage


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#73
Raklian

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Progress is progress.


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What are you without the sum of your parts?

#74
Italian Ufo

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Yeah for Rhode Island!



#75
Italian Ufo

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I had some nice memory in Block Island from my early 20s...very nice..lots of italians too lol



#76
ADAM LESTER ELLIOTT

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LONDON — The British government published a bill to legalize same-sex marriage Friday, and said lawmakers will get their first vote on it in Parliament next month.

The Marriage (Same-Sex Couples) Bill extends marriage to gay couples but excludes clergy in the Church of England — the country’s official faith — from having to carry out the ceremonies.

That is intended to placate religious opponents of same-sex unions — though it has not stopped criticism of the bill from religious leaders.

Posted Image“We feel that marriage is a good thing and we should be supporting more couples to marry and that is exactly what the proposals being brought forward today do,” Equalities Minister Maria Miller told BBC radio. this is from this link:http://www.lgbtqnati...e-sex-marriage/


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#77
Time_Traveller

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Gay marriage: Tory chairmen call for delay on vote

 

Posted Image

 

Sun 3 Feb - 

 

Senior local Conservatives are urging the prime minister to delay any parliamentary decision on gay marriage until after the next election.

More than 20 Conservative Association chairmen have signed a letter to be delivered to No 10 on Sunday.

It warns of "significant damage to the Conservative Party in the run-up to the 2015 election" if the plans enter law.

The foreign secretary said MPs would be left to "make their own decision" when they voted on the plans next week.

The Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill would enable same-sex couples to get married in both civil and religious ceremonies, where a religious institution had formally consented, in England and Wales.

It would also allow couples who have previously entered into civil partnerships to convert their relationship into a marriage

 

From http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21312111

 

I agree with the Bill put would it be right to delay it until after the 2015 election?


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#78
Time_Traveller

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Gay marriage: Legislation passes Commons despite Tory opposition

 

MPs have approved legislation for same-sex marriage in England and Wales, despite the opposition of dozens of Conservative MPs.

The Commons voted in favour of the The Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill, by 400 to 175, a majority of 225, at the end of a full day's debate on the bill.

Prime Minister David Cameron has described the move as "an important step forward" that strengthens society.

About 140 Conservative MPs are thought to have voted against the plans.

Former children's minister and Conservative MP Tim Loughton told the BBC that he believed "140 or so" of his party colleagues had voted against the plans, along with "a small rump of Labour MPs" and "four Lib Dem MPs".

He added: "Apparently there's 132 Conservative MPs that voted in favour, so I think what we're going to see is that more Conservative MPs voted against this legislation than for it."

The MPs' decision to back the bill at second reading signifies that they approve it in principle. The legislation will now receive more detailed parliamentary scrutiny.

 

From http://www.bbc.co.uk...litics-21346220

 

Here we have it, history in the making but they'll have to wait now until after the 2015 election to do the bill.


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#79
Craven

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Gay marriage: Legislation passes Commons despite Tory opposition

 

Here we have it, history in the making but they'll have to wait now until after the 2015 election to do the bill.

 

I don't get it. Can you explain? What's the significance of this voting if it's not done yet? I'm not familiar with how this stuff works in UK.


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#80
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Gay marriage: Legislation passes Commons despite Tory opposition

 

Here we have it, history in the making but they'll have to wait now until after the 2015 election to do the bill.

 

I don't get it. Can you explain? What's the significance of this voting if it's not done yet? I'm not familiar with how this stuff works in UK.

 

Ah hang on got it wrong. Cameron said he'll legalise gay-marriage relationships by 2015.


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