26 replies to this topic

[Hogbobson]

Greetings, Futuretimeline-net Forum! Long time no chat!

 

 

I was wondering, indeed, could it be possible, perhaps even in the forseeable future, to do an ultimate gender swap?

 

These days we have men wanting to become women (especially in Asia, it seems), and in reverse as well, I do suppose. These poor sods were born in the wrong body, and thus undergo a variety of procedures to get physically different.

 

And I was wondering... could it be possible to change your gender on a cellular, genetic level as well?

 

I'm talking straight out changing your genes' Y to an X, or in reverse.

 

From there you could take a Bio-printer and make yourself a proper Uterus or something, but is the prerequisite possible?

 

Discuss away!

[Yuli Ban]

Bah, let us see entirely new genders!

[Futurist]

Does one need to have a chromosome change in order to avoid the rejection of a uterus transplant (from one's own DNA/genes/et cetera)? If not, and if a cure to aging is already found by that point in time, I don't see the point in changing one's chromosomes from a normal male XY to a normal female XX, or in reverse.

[kjaggard]

well you could feasibly create a uterus structure with xy cells, but it's ability to function would be hard to guess, and no matter what you do you just can't make an xy ovary.

 

I think that far more important on the list is to be able to reverse masculinization. It's very unfortunate that for a lot of the efforts to become the gender they feel they should have been born that they can get all the surgeries in the world and change everything legally but in many cases bone structures and hair patterns cannot be fixed and the absolute strain placed on the body by the hormones and such. Resolve that first as they are more important issues.

[Futurist]

well you could feasibly create a uterus structure with xy cells, but it's ability to function would be hard to guess, and no matter what you do you just can't make an xy ovary.

 

I think that far more important on the list is to be able to reverse masculinization. It's very unfortunate that for a lot of the efforts to become the gender they feel they should have been born that they can get all the surgeries in the world and change everything legally but in many cases bone structures and hair patterns cannot be fixed and the absolute strain placed on the body by the hormones and such. Resolve that first as they are more important issues.

Forgive my ignorance on this, but ovaries are the organs/body parts which produce human female eggs, correct? If so, one can simply use IVF and an egg donor to become pregnant if one's XY-uterus works/functions correctly. I probably agree with your second point. Do you think that reversing masculinization will eventually be possible, and if so, when?

Edited by Futurist, 18 June 2013 - 03:05 AM.

[kjaggard]

I'd say reversing bone thickening would be hard to do and dangerous. It's a hard situation to resolve and in all honesty it's not likely to happen until we can build living replacement bones for any bone in the human body and then implant them without crippling the person. For instance reworking the entire lower jaw without causing nerve damage, shrinking the rib cage and shoulder span, hands and feet, width of nose base, brow, pelvis. These are the areas which can make a male to female look manly, they also are areas most likely to outright kill or perminantly disable you if you remove the bones or make inscissions big enough to do so.

 

Women to men has some similar issues with always being shorter and having small hands and feet and broad hips, but in hormone based changes it's easier to build up bigger bones than reverse the process. Though not much can be done about the fact that their hieght is below average.

 

hair patterns will be much easier to adjust, and the body of knowledge in endocrinology is getting better. It's got a long way to go before there is less risk of shortened lifespan though.

 

I think the first steps will have to be improvements in soft tissue shaping and cosmetic changes with better endocrinology advances. It could help many, but there will still be many whole become women who look like linebackers.

 

I just think that in the end getting the body would be more important than which letters are used to make it. Nobody can see your genes in your daily life, and x or Y won't change anything for you now (well other than maybe making you infertile). So it's really little more than a formality at that point. Besides which there are women born with XY instead of XX. They still grow up identifying as women and live a fairly normal life as women in many cases. There is infertility and some minor health issues. but nobody can tell or would usually care.

[Hogbobson]

 (well other than maybe making you infertile). 

 

Ah! But what if you wanted to get around this?

[bee14ish]

Why not both?

[kjaggard]

generally speaking high levels of female homones kill off sperm production cells, and heavy testosterone shut down the ovaries. Even in intersexed people with ovatestes they generally are incapable of generating viable reproductive cells.

 

to say nothing of the endometrium and ability to form plascenta and regular hormone levels needed during pregnancy. we are complex chemical factories and while we can chemically force changes in a heavy handed bumble fingered way to look kind of right we do not have the finesse to pull this off very well without hard core heavy medication and a lot of failure and collateral damage to tissues along the way.

[Zeitgeist123]

kjaggard, bone structures are being reduced in south korea for several years now to achieve a more feminine look. i think the most challenging is for guys with feminine bone structure to have a more masculine jawline or nose bridge without using some invasive materials such as silicon, etc. but i think that can be fixed in the near future with stem cell technology.

 

i remember a thread we had before about these 2 pictures and letting people guess which of the 2 are biologically female by birth:

#1:

==============================================================================

 

#2:

 

 

a lot of people would guess and would think that picture #1 was the transexual. but in reality, #2 used to be the male. Pciture #2 got numerous surgeries done to be a female, (but looks very natural). But picture #1 is naturally female (already birthed 1 beautiful kid) and never had any cosmetic surgery done, her face is just naturally bony.

 

moral of the story:

 

1.) can't judge a book by its cover

2.) when going to asia, be careful who you're choosing to go on a 1-night stand with, cuz you will never know unless you get to know them better for a little while.

Edited by Zeitgeist123, 19 June 2013 - 08:57 PM.

[kjaggard]

The procedures for jaw reshaping involve peeling using a saw to hack out a chunk of jaw and heal it like a broken bone. you can reshape the bridge of the nose but not the base (the width of the opening in the skull), you can shave brow ridges but you can't adjust the slope of the brow. Not to mention you cannot change shoulders, pelvis or hands and feet.

 

Also, no offense here but the sexual dimorphism in asiastic features are less pronounced. It's a common saying among the transgendered folks I know that asian transexuals have it easy, they can look natural with little work.

 

no amount of surgery is going to make this person look like a natural born female.

 

hands, jaw, shoulders and nose. You can work on some of their details but the way in which they effect the rest of the bodies build simply can't change.

 

ditto with

[inkybinky3]

Bah, let us see entirely new genders!

YES! ANOTHER ONE OF MY DREAMS!

Sorry, had to do that.

 

Hard to imagine, but possible. RANDOM CHROMOSOMES! OF! KG! TY! XX (Wait... That already exists...)!

[inkybinky3]

maybe there really is other genders, but they were slowly 'phased out' by evolution.

[Alric]

There are other genders today, there is actually a fairly large number of conditions that can give you a sex besides purely male and purely female.

[Troodon]

How about changing your chromosomes from XY to XX, but without getting any sex change? I would actually like that idea, since I want to be able to live longer, but I also want to remain a guy.

[SG-1]

By the time we can do that Troodon, we will be able to at least bridge the gender life-span gap, and then some probably.  Progress with longevity is going well experimentally in mice.  I hope that before I kick the can I can reach longevity escape velocity.

[rtardx]

Whenever I perceive anything even related to Transsexualism my stomach cringes. The word itself is the embodiment of pain to me.

[FutureOfToday]

What about YY chromosomes? Will it ever be possible to have someone with such genetics?

[Futurist]

What about YY chromosomes? Will it ever be possible to have someone with such genetics?

This might be very unlikely, since the X chromosome apparently contains vital information/materials for life.

[FutureOfToday]

Perhaps, but maybe with later advancements we could somehow come up with an alternative for the X chromosome. Who knows? Maybe there is a "third gender" we don't know about.